The following is a transcript of our podcast conversation with Sarah Wilkins and Lori Prutsman. You can listen to the full episode on Spotify or Apple Podcasts.
03/12/2024
Lori
Sarah Wilkins
Hello and welcome to Humans Beyond Resources, an HR podcast by Reverb where we cover topics from culture to compliance. Reverb believes that every decision a leader makes reverberates throughout the organization, from hiring your first employee to training your entire workforce. We believe in building healthy, inclusive cultures that engage your team. I’m your host, Sarah Wilkins.
Thank you to our Humans Beyond Resources podcast sponsors, Parker Smith & Feek, AHT, and Joshua Brittingham of Carney, Badley & Spelman.
Today, Lori Prutsman, also known as the burnout coach, is joining me to talk about all things burnout, stress boundaries, things like that. So Lori is a coach, facilitator, and speaker on finding balance, reducing stress, and boosting joy, which I know we all need more of in our lives. At the start of the year, you know, we set goals, resolutions, or intentions, whatever you you know, want to name them and find ourselves sometimes wondering how to maintain balance or hold tight to boundaries to protect us from stress and burnout. So I’m really excited for this conversation with Lori today. Thanks so much for joining.
Lori Prutsman
Yes, thanks so much for reaching out and asking me to come on to the podcast. It’s very exciting. Absolutely. Yeah, I remember getting to
Sarah Wilkins
talk to you at one of our HR meetups, maybe a couple years ago now. So very excited to revisit it and hear from you again. So thanks. Yeah, first start off by trying to learn more about you and wanting to for you to share more about yourself and your story and why you became focused on burnout.
Lori Prutsman
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I’ll start by describing, I think me kind of my life who I was by one of my favorite quotes by Brené Brown, which is, if you don’t want to burn out, stop living your life like you’re on fire. And I can really relate to this because this was me back in 2017. So I had worked with Fortune 500 companies rising up through management and senior leadership and talent management at Amazon and booking .com is where I ended my career. And I feel fortunate to have those experiences because I feel like they really were stepping stones for me to get where I’m at now. And I was in recruiting for you know, 15 years, which is funny, because when I look back, I remember I made a transition from sales into recruiting. And at that time, I’m still in touch with a recruiter who I talked to at that time. And I remember telling her, I really want to get out of sales, I want to do something more meaningful. And I think I might want to do coaching. And she was like, what? Because it wasn’t really that it wasn’t really a thing back then. And I was a lot younger, obviously. And she She said, I think you should get into recruiting. And so I did, but I knew that coaching was always kind of in the back of my mind. And so where I was at, I just, you know, had been working 60 hour work weeks. I had constant travel. I just began feeling and noticing this burnout and just feeling literally like a physically depleted in my body. I felt like I had a huge loss of joy and detachment from myself. And really I felt like, what am I doing? I just kept asking myself that question. Like what am I doing? You know, the deep question of like, what is my life’s calling? And I knew that I wasn’t happy. And I always felt the sense of just panic and constant anxiety regardless of what I was doing. It was kind of, it was my final corporate role when I was at booking, when I had my big aha moment. And it truly was a wake up call for me. Um, I was, it was during a year where I was flying 50 ,000 miles a year because our corporate offices were in Amsterdam and I was running talent management for all the Americas. So I at this time was on a work trip down in Florida and I was doing a recruiting training for three days down there in the beginning of January. And I went out for the morning to get some decongestant because I was sick once again because I felt like I was always sick because I was constantly traveling and not taking care of myself. And I remember pulling out of a parking lot and this woman just came, or I was driving down the street and one came flying out of this parking lot and just hit, spun my car. So I was in a car accident. And the first thing I did was open the car door, stand up, look up at the sky, shake my fist and say, I don’t have time for this. I have too much effing work today. Before I even realized, you know, we’re in a busy four lanes of traffic. There was construction guys in the middle of the road. Am I okay? Was she okay? You know, my bumpers hanging on the ground. It just, it happened so fast. And so I fast forward, took care of that, came back to Seattle and was instructed by a handful of doctors to really start taking care of myself, the, to, to repair all my injuries. I had neck, back and shoulder injuries. The first thing that one of my doctors said was, you absolutely should not be getting on a plane. You should not be traveling for work. And I remember thinking, okay, sure, yeah, no problem. Thinking in my mind, I’ll be fine. I got this. I can do this. It’s no problem. So five months go by and I was not taking care of myself. My shoulder got worse. I ended up not seeing my physical therapist or doing the intense medical massage I was supposed to doing or doing the acupuncture, ended up getting frozen shoulder. It was really, really bad. And I remember I just kept saying, I’m just so busy. I’m so busy, I have too much work. It’s more important than, you know, I have to do this work. I have to do this work. I just didn’t have the time to put into myself, into my own body to heal, right? And I was literally like physically and mentally just imploding. I remember days where I would just cry in my office with the door closed, like, what am I doing? I can’t do this. And in so much pain, I mean, like Advil all day, you know, coming home, like drink wine at night, like this will help. I’ll feel better. It was just horrible. Meanwhile, my husband’s on the sidelines, just watching this, like, what are you doing to yourself? Why are you doing this? I think the first time in my life, honestly, because I had my first job when I was 15, that I ever really focused on me. And it was also the hardest thing. Like, I remember that first week of being on a medical, like a formal medical leave of absence, no laptop, I can’t contact anybody. I remember walking around my kitchen island in the morning when my husband drove off to work and I’m like, oh my God, what do I do? What am I supposed to do? What am I supposed to do? You know, just this feeling of being tethered. You know, you’re tethered to your laptop, you’re tethered to your cell phone. And just this desire, like this need to be needed was ferocious. Like that was my feeling of accomplishment. So many people need me at work. So it really gave me time to step back and reflect. And what I realized during this downtime was that I had really lost myself. Like I lost true sight of myself and who I was. And part of that was who I was in relationships with others. And it was sad. I mean, it was really, really sad. So everything had become about work. It was my whole identity. My life was about beating targets, making the best hires, process improvement, you know, training all of our employees. And I made myself always available to my managers, to my team, to my candidates. And then I would just feel shame and guilt when I would wrap up a day and not be done with the work or my to -do list, I was so tightly wound. I mean, it was, I just remember looking back and I remember those feelings and it was really sad. You know, there’s many stories and experiences that my friends and families can could share about this, but really through the, you know, support of my husband and just realizing like, hey I’m ready for you to give up this 70 -hour work week that you think is It’s really important to you. And I realized that I needed this change of pace and my focus of work just altogether. And while I think corporate America is great, I’m not saying that it’s not, it just wasn’t great for me anymore. And I realized that because I have a really, I know myself really well, and I know that I have a really hard time saying no. So I quit my job after my three month leave of absence, and I remember going in and giving my notice and saying to my manager at the time that I’m leaving because corporate America no longer serves me. And the look of like, huh, like it just did not compute for him, just didn’t get it. And then I took a year long integral coaching certification program, which changed my life for the better and forever. And it’s what led me to do the work. So in 2017, I started taking on coaching and I’ve been doing it ever since. And I’ve been focusing on helping clients from executives all the way down to college students with burnout and burnout prevention and boundary setting, choosing authentic living and just really finding deeper meaning with joy in their lives. So that’s, that’s my story.
Sarah Wilkins
Thank you so much for sharing and going through all of that. and many things stood out. But yeah, I see you in the kitchen being like, What do I do now? After, you know, years of your career and like spending so much time on work, and then all of a sudden being at this place where you’re like, What do I do? I can only imagine that feeling. Yeah, for sure. Going now into kind of we’re at the start of the year, I guess it’s already February, but it’s still the start of the year. And, you know, this is often a great time for us to take stock of where we are and what we need to maintain our own balance. And so given your, you know, story, your expertise and what you work on, do you have any tips for people on how to do this and, you know, especially how to implement or stick to boundaries, which I know is a really hard thing for people?
Lori Prutsman
Yeah, absolutely. Um, well, I would be remiss if I didn’t first touch on a lot of people are feeling like, God, I just do feel burnt out and I need to maintain my balance and I need to set boundaries and stick to them. But I would be remiss if I didn’t just talk for a quick second about the reality of workplace burnout because it’s both a workplace and it’s both the employee’s responsibility. I feel, and in 2023, 62 % of employees in the U S reported feeling burned out. That’s across all the U .S., across many different fields of work. And then you add on the evolution of technology in the workplace where employees believe that they’re expected to always be on 24 seven now. And 74 % of employees felt that they were working more hours than they did before the pandemic, right? Because we have a lot of employees that are still working from home, so they have this hybrid blend and the lines of work and personal have blended. So now it’s even harder than it was before. Now I’ll move into kind of how do you maintain balance and boundaries in doing this, right? And maintaining this balance piece, it’s not easy unless you make it a priority. I’m gonna say this again. You have to make it a priority and it’s the hardest part. And I know that that sounds a lot easier than it is. Here’s a couple of things I’ll share that I kind of talk with my clients a lot about. And I think the first thing I usually will have them do, because trust me, almost every single one of my clients, this is something, an aspect of their coaching that we’re working on together. The first thing is taking inventory on what really even knowing in your life, like what nurtures you and then what stresses you out. And this takes time to do this list, right? And to really think about it, because it’s something that’s really big And it’s truly knowing what this looks like for you. And I want you to go even deeper with it and think about, when you’re thinking about this list that nurtures you, it’s like, what does that feel like? So when you’re coming up with this list, it’s not about just doing a checklist and writing the things down, but what does it feel like in your heart, in your body, for your soul, for you? What are the things that you know nurture you? And then what are the things that you really know are stressing you out? And this list is gonna hit home. And sadly to say, the things that stress you out are probably going to be a little bit bigger than the things that nurture you, which is a telltale sign that you probably need to work on setting boundaries and building boundaries and working on some balance. So then we’ll go into, you know, we start setting some of these boundaries. Part of that is really strengthening the work and private life barriers. That’s how it has to be. You can’t always be on like I was, right? Like I shared in my story. I’ve learned this the hard way. Like I know this, I am speaking truth to this. You can’t always be available. You have to take you time. And as a leader and an executive, especially it’s so important to set these as examples. And I love how you guys do this at Reverb and share this journey that you guys are on with this. It’s just beautiful to watch it unfold. I love this quote from Helen Keller, a bend in the road is not the end of the road, unless you fail to make a turn. Realize like, okay, this is not working for me. I’ve got to try something else. First, you have to recognize it. You recognize that there’s a need for change. Then it’s how to best do this. There’s different levels of this for everyone, But there are some steps that you can kind of consider around how to set boundaries, how to kind of do this. How can I keep my balance? First of all, what do I mean by boundaries? Because I tell you again, every single one of my clients struggles with this and they’re like boundaries. What is that? I don’t even understand that. What is it? Sounds lovely. I don’t even know what it means. And so perfectly put, I love this description of it. Boundaries are limits we identify for ourselves and apply through action or communication. When we define what we need to feel secure and healthy, when we need it and create tools to protect those parts of ourselves, we can do wonders for our wellbeing at work and at home, which in turn allows us to bring our best selves to both places. Like that’s really the goal for yourself about like, what would it look like and feel like? That kind of feels like, ah, that feels good. So there’s a lot of boundaries to set and descriptions of them. There’s things that you can, maybe you’ve heard of like hard boundaries or soft boundaries. You know, hard boundaries are really kind of the non -negotiables that you can set for yourself. Those can be harder, harder to set, right? Like, how do I say no to my boss? Like a hard boundary is setting no. Soft boundaries are goals that you want to reach, but you might be a little more flexible around. Like I’m going to practice taking two work breaks a day for maybe two days a week. I mean, that’s a baby place to start, but for some people, literally that’s where they’re at. Some people don’t even do that. So my point in that is that there’s all kinds of things that you can start. It’s just a simple start. Or simply put, like just saying yes to things that really matter to you in your life, right? Like nurture stress and give a firm, polite no to things that don’t matter. It, I’ll tell you one of the biggest empowering things for me after that whole burnout journey, I finally learned the power of no, it has altered my life forever. Like when I get to say no, I get so excited when I get to say no. Now it’s It’s just like, oh, could you? And I’m like, no, and I used to be like, no, I’m so sorry. Here’s why, because now it’s just like, no. And I just leave it at that. And it feels so good. I’m also not worried about how it occurs for the other person. This is my personal boundary that I’ve worked really hard on setting, really empowering. So it takes time. You don’t always get a start out there, but some ways I think that you can set healthy boundaries. And this is also about building resilience in your own life too, right? Some things are set clear expectations. That’s one way to think about doing it. Take breaks and think more about play. I mean, really, it’s just, I feel like, you think about kids, right? God, they just, everything is about play, play, play, play. Think about play. I mean, I’ve even given, And literally I had to give to one of my executives finger painting as a practice, get them to just stop for a minute. They just could not get out of their own way.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah.
Lori Prutsman
And it worked. It helped. It, you know, the breakthroughs that they had from that was, were pretty amazing. Another thing is just learning to say no, like you just have to practice and you start or when practicing with somebody safe that you can just say no to and you practice that. Prioritizing self -care is another one that is so important. And then learn to switch off technology boundaries, right? Like no screen time. I don’t mean like, I’m gonna switch from work and now I’m gonna sit and scroll Instagram for two hours a night.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah.
Lori Prutsman
Like no screen time.
Sarah Wilkins
Turn it off, put it away.
Lori Prutsman
Yeah. One of the things I do for a break in the middle of the day, this sounds so funny, but in my backyard and anytime I have guests over, they’re always just amazed and they laugh. I’ve got literally like probably six bird feeders and I have squirrels and birds in my backyard, hummingbird feeders, and I will just go sit and stare out my kitchen window, make a cup of tea and take like 10 minutes or 15 minutes and just chill and decompress. Not with my, I leave my cell phone in my office, nothing. And just sit. Because it literally is giving my brain a moment to look at something else, to be away from technology, to not be thinking in those manners. And it really does help kind of reset and re -stimulate your whole body, like all your sensories. And there’s a lot of science behind this and a lot of the things I’m sharing also. The other thing is learning how to delegate when you can. We want to think that our way is the only way and our little perfectionist brains have to do it all or it’s not going to be done correctly. Learning how to delegate is something that can be really powerful and getting organized ahead of time is something else to do to help us with, you know, setting these boundaries and gaining more resilience and being more in control. And then lean on your support system, asking for help. It’s another really hard one for people to do. And then honestly paying attention to your body signals, which I clearly did not do and sleep, sleep, sleep, sleep, and relaxation. I cannot say how important that is for your whole being, you know, and remember that setting boundaries is, um, it’s an ongoing process, right? You have to keep like trying it out and then reviewing it and seeing how it works. How does it feel? But if you can start with this, you’ll find that you’re going to have more energy to support you in, you know, finding and maintaining more balance in your life. And, and, you know, for me personally, over the years, I’ve just found that it does take a lot of practice, a lot of practice. I mean, it’s taken me six years to get to it. And even, you know, you and I were talking, because I had to reschedule our first session, this because I was sick again. And I thought, Why am I getting sick? Oh, yeah, because I’m just walking all over my boundaries. I was not paying attention to things. I was burning the candle at both ends. So it’s a constant work in progress, but things find the things that can support you with holding those healthy boundaries, things like having balanced and important relationships in your life that can support you that you really enjoy. And lots of mindfulness practices, you know, that we have, it can be sports or hobbies that you love. For me, it’s being out in the fresh air and riding my Harley whenever the sun is out. It’s like my favorite thing in the world. Meditating is another thing, honestly. And that can be any form of meditating, journaling, gratitude practices. There are so many different things to really help with that process.
Sarah Wilkins
Those are all such great tips. And it made me think, you know, the hard and soft boundaries are just how important leadership is to back to like, you can do so much for yourself. But then when you’re in a corporate situation or at work, like having leaders that also practice and respect these things, right, and you called out reverb, and I think, like, me prior to reverb, I maybe didn’t, like, wanted to have boundaries, but like, it was hard, right? Because there wasn’t a leadership support of that. And being somewhere where you do have a leader, and it’s you’re setting clear expectations. Here’s the job. And here’s what we expect to get done. Do it in the way that works best for you. Right? And that Yeah, take Fridays and don’t do calls or Yeah, make sure like, you know, I was talking to someone and I have about like, I don’t do meetings before nine o ‘clock. And I don’t do meetings after 4 .30 because I have a seven -year -old daughter and I want to spend time with her in the morning and after work. And those are my like harder boundaries, right? And so it took me a long time to get there. It wasn’t there five years ago, but I feel like, you know, it is practice and having supportive leadership and a supportive organization, you know, really helps
Lori Prutsman
that too. So. Absolutely. Yeah. And I think being courageous in the environments and the cultures where they are, there’s just pure toxicity, right? I mean, you would not believe the stories that I hear from my clients around workplace behavior. And a lot of it, you know, isn’t necessarily can always be changed at just their level with them being one person. But there are steps that they can take and that they feel empowered enough after some of their own self work to take to try to say, Hey, what can I do as a collective to change this? right. And I also, I remember doing a burnout workshop where they really I gave them a lot of time to brainstorm around what can we take back to our workplaces and say, we’ve got to change something like it cannot keep going at this pace. We’ve got to take stuff to leadership and have these conversations in HR and try to move the needle a little bit. And I think some of that is changing a bit, right? It’s coming more prevalent, the conversations are starting to open up a little bit more understanding that you’re going to lose talent, you’re burning people out that you you’re going to have a hard time hiring people starting to ask these questions. Now, their work life balance is really important to them.
Sarah Wilkins
Absolutely. Yeah, the difference in when I started my career to where I where it is now, right. And how much this talked about and work life, you know, having those boundaries and that balance. Um, like it’s a non -negotiable for most people now. So yeah. Yeah. You mentioned, you know, lots of practices and specifically you, you know, even shared your own story of like how you had to check in with yourself about other practices you specifically recommend kind of at the start of a year at certain.
Lori Prutsman
I finally, I just had to, this was probably four, four years ago or so. I finally just gave up big new year’s resolutions, right. I seem to fail them. And then beat myself up for the failure. And they’re usually big lofty resolutions and they lose, honestly, they lose importance kind of after January. I really feel attainable, but they sound really bold in the moment, like I’m going to get this done. So I started realizing like, okay, I don’t want to set myself up for failure. So I started thinking about it in a different way. And I actually started building, I’ve been doing women’s retreats now in the first quarter of each year, um, that are called your intentional year. And it’s really about, um, and this isn’t just focused on women. I mean, my retreats are yes, but what I’m going to share now is anybody can use these tips. So it’s about giving yourself time to really reflect and renew and step into the new year wholeheartedly with a lot of clarity because of the way that you’re able to reflect on the past year. and then what am I wanting more of or less of moving into the new year? And kind of taking it in collectively as all areas of your life, not just like, oh, it’s gotta be around, I wanna get promoted at work and I’m gonna lose 25 pounds and I’m, you know, some of the things that we said, I think sometimes irresponsible for me anyway, goals I can never seem to meet. So I’m learning also for myself, what’s interesting, this is the first year that I’ve really learned it I’ve been feeling it is that not to push myself in January, like really feeling that January is, I just need a break from the holidays. I mean, you start thinking about it, like November, December, it just push, push, push, push, push up into new years. I’m really feeling like I’ve used January. I just want to kind of hibernate. I want to read. I want to nest. I want to maybe organize. And so I’m starting this process now too, that I’m going to kind of talk about that to be using. But this this process of reflection on the previous year, I start by kind of reviewing the previous year month by month. And I break it down into areas. From I look at like my personal life, I look at my family life, I look at health, and work life, like studies, how am I learning? How am I continuing to better myself? I look at professional and I look at community, emotional, spiritual, and finances. And then there’s even like a bucket list. Like, what did I do fun? Like, did I do something bold? And then, and from there, you kind of move into these powerful statements to summarize it all up. So you look at things like the wisest decision I made, the biggest risk I took, the biggest surprise for the year, the most important thing I did for others, biggest thing I completed. What am I most grateful for? Best things I discovered about myself. And there’s many, many more. That’s just a little snippet of some of the things. So it’s definitely much more enriching than just looking at, oh, here’s my New Year’s resolutions. And then these are kind of the two that always seem to, are kind of really deep and meaningful for me to kind of put the last year to rest, which are, what do I want to let go of in order to move into the new year? Because I always feel like there’s something that’s kind of holding us back, right? God, if I could just rest and be done with it. And then who or what needs to be forgiven in order to move on. So then moving into 2024 now or into your next year is thinking about what would your big dreams be, right? And this is kind of thinking about what do I really want? because we really don’t take the time to feel like we can dream big or feel like this is what I’d really love to have happen. And so kind of just experiencing with that. Things about what you want to, you know, what you feel like you want to achieve, what you want to dare to discover, what relationships maybe are important to you that you want to work on, what you want to have the power to say yes and no to, what do you want to make a priority, and I love this one. How will you pamper yourself? Yeah. Three things that you’ll do every morning for yourself. I’m all about morning rituals. A lot of my clients I give morning rituals to. And then this year I’ll advise myself to do what, right? I’ll draw strength from what or whom. So it’s really about putting these building blocks in place to support you. And the beautiful thing about this is that continuing to be in this for the year, yes, this is kind of the start of the year, but it also keeps that cadence throughout the year, right? To help you stay in your own resolution and resilience of what do I want for myself? Because again, it is about putting you first. So who’s in charge of their own burnout and stress and balance? Us at the end of the day. And I know it’s hard. Like you’ve, you’ve got to stop and take reflection first and notice that you need that support and then do something about it again, which is hard, which is why I always say, it’s great to find a great coach to work with and support you on that journey. And then I say during the year to kind of help, you know, reduce the stress and burnout is just, um, the biggest thing I think that we don’t do is just stop for a moment, turn inward. I mean, I myself, I’m the biggest, like I do this all the time. I notice it’s just like you wake up and you’re just like, go, go, go, go, go, go, go. And I even, you know, I’ll coach a couple clients during the day and you’re doing other things. And then all of a sudden it’s four o ‘clock and I think, oh my God, I haven’t even, how did I not eat lunch today yet? You know? And I know many people go through the days rushed and we just forget sometimes. And it literally will take a minute or two minutes to just stop and get ourselves centered. This means like turn off or walk away from all forms of technology. To just really turn inward. And it means having compassion and empathy to listen and see what we need. We have to ask ourselves, what do I need? Sometimes you really ask yourself during the day, what do I need right now in this moment, right? You’re shaking your head, no, because like we don’t, people don’t. And then when we ask ourself that and we realize what we might need, the next biggest step is don’t dismiss it or push that feeling down or act like that little voice inside us that is saying what we need or what our body is sharing with us what we need. Don’t ignore it. So that’s the cycle that we really have to break in order to support ourselves in our own balance and reducing our stress and really taking care of ourselves. We need to be recharged. Just like every single day, what do we do with our cell phones? Oh, we plug them in and we recharge them every day. A lot of times we just don’t do that with ourselves. So we need to do that and we need to find kind of what works for ourselves. And there’s something about stillness for us that is just so, so important, but yet we have this inner voice, right? That runs us and tells us like, oh no, we just gotta keep going, keep going. There’s, I wanna read this little excerpt from this book I have on, it’s called Instinctive Drives of the Enneagram from John Lukovic. I read this the other day and it literally stopped me in my tracks. And I was like, oh, wow, that’s, yeah, that’s why this keeps happening. So he says, when the ego’s desires override the body’s wellbeing, this creates problems for us physically and psychologically. It means our nervous system stays chronically dysregulated and our bodies become locked into patterns of stress and tension that feel normal. One reason that stillness is such an important factor in spiritual practices, for example, is because it is very difficult to refine the sensitivity and clarity of consciousness when our nervous system is bound up in tension, emotional reaction, and chronic thoughts from its distress. So our inner work begins when we learn through physical sensation to be sensitive to our actual present state instead of our egos, ideas, concepts, and stories about what we need. We start to bridge this disparity by learning to consciously self -regulate. And that was just such a, I don’t know, I knew that, but to see that in writing again and realize, oh yeah, it’s our little egos that just run us all day and keep us going, even though our bodies are screaming to be cared for. So I think, you know, I think we have to have a behavior change within ourself and it’s hard. And what I say is you’ve got to become selfish, right? You have to set healthy boundaries and nobody can do it for you. You’ve got
Sarah Wilkins
to do it for yourself. Yeah, absolutely. I mean all of this has been so great and And I know personally for me, such good things that I can take away and remind myself of and yeah, the stillness particularly. So as we wrap up, any closing thoughts or items that you want to make sure listeners really take away? I mean, the last one was great. You’ve got to set them for yourself. No one else can do it, but yeah. What else?
Lori Prutsman
Yeah. I mean, I would say, um, you know, if I’ve learned nothing else from my own breakout or break down, um, like burnout moment, I would say is that, um, you know, I’ve learned, I’m the only one that can take care of me the way that I need to be tended to.
Sarah Wilkins
Right.
Lori Prutsman
So if I’m not taking care of me, I can’t help and support anyone else. Like in my coaching practice, I know that I’m a horrible coach if I’m not fully cared for and rested and having joy in my life. So it’s important that I do all of that, just as it is for others to take care of themselves so they can be the best humans, I think, for themselves. And, you know, I know it sounds easier than it is, right? But it’s extremely empowering, I think, and freeing to put yourself first in order to be the best version of yourself. And lastly, I would say, be brave enough to set clear boundaries, and love yourself enough to honor them. Yeah, I love that. And, and I would also say if you you know, I do a lot of I send out a Sunday newsletter, you can go to my website at Laurie pretzman .com. And you can sign up for those if you’re interested. And there’s I have a lot more information and resources on just burnout and different books that I recommend and things like that. So if you’re interested on any more topics, feel free to reach out and you can also find all my social tracking ways through the website as well.
Sarah Wilkins
Absolutely. Well, thank you so much. It’s always great to hear from you and learn from you. I really appreciate you coming on today. So thank you.
Lori Prutsman
You’re so welcome. Thanks for having me. It’s always great reminders for myself and just I love obviously talking about this information and sharing it because it’s so important.
Sarah Wilkins
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