The following is a transcript of our podcast conversation with Sarah Wilkins and Sarah Roberts. You can listen to the full episode on Spotify or Apple Podcasts.
Sarah Wilkins
Hello and welcome to Humans Beyond Resources, an HR podcast by Reverb where we cover topics from culture to compliance. Reverb believes that every decision a leader makes reverberates throughout the organization, from hiring your first employee to training your entire workforce. We believe in building healthy, inclusive cultures that engage your team. I’m your host, Sarah Wilkins.
Thank you to our Humans Beyond Resources podcast sponsors, Parker Smith & Feek, AHT, and Joshua Brittingham of Carney, Badley & Spelman.
Sarah Wilkins
Today I’m speaking with Sarah Roberts, Chief of Staff for Customer Success and Insights and former head of Military and Veterans Programs at LinkedIn. After hearing about your story from our CEO, Michaela, of how LinkedIn supported your return from parental leave for your last child, we wanted to share your story of how employers can create leave policies that support the workforce. So thank you so much for joining today. I look forward to our discussion.
Sarah Roberts
Yeah, I’m so excited to be here. Thank you for that introduction.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah, so now diving into kind of parental leave, you shared having that you have three children and I know you went on leave from different companies each time. So maybe this will come up, but first, one of the things that inspired Makayla was just how you shared about your story of coming back of your leave at LinkedIn and coming back and how they supported you in your return following. So could you share more about that and how that was for you?
Sarah Roberts
Yeah, for sure. I will first start and say my third was a pandemic baby. So I found out I was pregnant in March of 2020, which was, you know, magical timing. And also in the midst of that moved from San Francisco back to the Northwest. I did a year tour of duty before like this remote sort of evolution was a thing. So I had begged essentially to move back up here, which is where I’m from. And that was all sort of happening in the midst of my pregnancy. And so I went out on mat leave in October after she was born and came back in March. So we have, you know, a fairly generous maternity leave policy. But the biggest gift for me was the coaching that I was able to participate in, which is open to all working parents at LinkedIn and as part of your benefits and your return to work. And I was connected with a wonderful coach and was able to just talk and work through all of the feelings of the transition. And my biggest takeaway is I just wish I would have had that for my first one because I went through a lot of just soul searching and a lot of bumps thinking like what was wrong with me. Looking back, it’s just like the natural ebb and flow of coming back after, one, having, you know, having a baby, having Matt leave, being off for a period of time, and then having to transition back to a full -time job. So, yeah, she was amazing. Having the ability to just talk through, like, do I feel like I need to settle in my role? I’d been in that role for two years. There’s the just sort of natural process of like, am I ready to lean in more? How do I balance all of this? How do I have like these vulnerable and open conversations with my peers, with my manager on maybe how things have changed and evolved since before I went on mat leave. So it was just such a gift to be able to have that space that was outside of like my core team, but it felt like a safe person I could talk to who could help me just sort of talk out and think through and like process and help guide and really coach me on sort of this, this process. I think it lasted for four or five, six months. And yeah, it was a great benefit.
Sarah Wilkins
I love the idea of the coaching. And I last, last year, I talked to a coach who focused on kind of parental parental leave coaching, you know, even leading up to the leave and then in your return. And I know when we were chatting just how much has changed as far as leave goes from your first to your last and the benefits and things like that that are provided. Is there anything else that was really helpful to you regarding kind of your return? I know some companies allow for, you know, partial hours re -entry or, you know, those types of things. What else was kind of different for you this time around? Yeah.
Sarah Roberts
I think the biggest gift for me in the third, I was fully remote. And so all of the things that really stressed me out with the first one, I was commuting into an office and I was commuting like an hour plus. So I was being a little off, like making that transition to the office and not having that, um, was like the best thing ever because I felt like I wasn’t as stressed like the, all the evening preparation, the morning hustle, it was to a lesser degree. So that was one, and if there’s anything organizations can do to support sort of a remote transition or a hybrid transition back, I think that would have helped me a lot with my first. And just like, this sounds so random, but if you’re a mom that’s like breastfeeding or pumping, like the process of like finding a room, finding the space, bringing your laptop, getting set up, it does take away from your day and so finding the time and just the mental load to plan for that versus like, I could close my laptop, you know, I could work on other things and I could do that remote without having to think about all the extra logistics. And I think the other piece too is you underestimate how sick your kids get in that first year. And so I was, I mean, my daughter, my youngest one goes to daycare and so having the access to be able to pick her up, take her to the doctor, have her home, and still be able to do the majority of my job. I also acknowledge that’s coming from a very privileged place. Not everybody has that gift, but from an employer perspective, just even if I were to have that for the first three or four months as I was transitioning back, and then gradually being able to come back more into an office, I think really helps retain women in the workforce, but also keep the energy, because I think that there’s such an energy, um, suck as a new parent with a sleep deprivation and all of the planning. And so I think like anything you can do to like boost that person’s energy level helps them endure. Like I always remind my team and other people I’m working with, it’s a marathon, not a sprint. And you know, that like parenthood is a marathon. And so like, yes, there’s going to be seasons that are more taxing and that first year is one of them. And So the more you can help employees navigate that as a marathon, if it comes from experience or if you’ve been a parent before or if you’ve been surrounded by other people that are parents, just like being able to model that for your employees, I think is really helpful. And I had the gift of working for a leader who modeled that to me and then being surrounded with a team of people that were supportive. I think that other piece that I would add is acknowledging where families or people are in their parental journey, there is an age component. And for me, I skewed a little bit older on that scale, but also most of my team did not have children yet. And so I felt sort of like the lone person paving the way at LinkedIn for this younger team, whereas at other organizations, that wasn’t the case. But I feel like having the experience of being the person that has done this before, that knows what to expect, I feel like I was able to impart that experience on newer employees that are now going out on mat leave, now that I’m on the other end of that childbearing journey, if you will.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah. I love that you pointed that out because I think it’s so important that people see leaders taking the leave and taking full advantage of the benefits. And, you know, having women do it, but then also seeing male counterparts or others, you know, other parents taking the same type of benefits, right? And so have you seen, regardless of gender, parents taking advantage of these benefits? And how has that gone at LinkedIn? Because I feel like when I was taking my leave, it was the non -birthing parent got less leave. they were less likely to take time away and all of that. And I know that just is not as hope that’s changed a lot. And that’s been great, but I still think there’s some stigma sometimes around taking the full leave for non birthing parents occasionally.
Sarah Roberts
Yeah, for sure. I think, I think, unfortunately, I think that stereotype does still exist, but I think the modeling at LinkedIn, And I’ve seen more leaders that are the non -birthing parent take that leave and be creative about it. Like if somebody is in a sales role, maybe they take it in chunks versus taking the whole thing at once. But really finding ways to maximize that benefit. So it feels a lot less taboo than maybe it did five or six years ago or before. And so I’m seeing more of that. I also would call out like the benefits, not just through the company, but through the state in which you reside. I missed out on the newer benefits that exist through Washington State, but I’ve talked to many parents where the non -birthing parent has been able to leverage those state benefits in a way that maybe their employer isn’t able to offer. And so I think like it’s also not just like a company policy component. I think there’s a much larger component around what are, how you can work to create legislation that supports not just working women, like this is working families, like it takes two parents to, you know, raise this human and to be able to have the support of both parties, I think is like game changing and it keeps, it creates more equity across, you know, dual working families, which I think is really important for, you know, our economy and, you know, fostering that that growth across our workforce.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah, absolutely. I love yeah, pointing out the the state level benefits, right? Because not all companies either are able to or do offer kind of that full suite of leave. But you know, states like Washington, where we reside, and others have started adding those benefits to their states. And I’ve, you to a lot of parents and how they’ve combined the leaves and done all these things to, you know, support the transition back and, you know, handle the child care. Because child care for infants is so hard to come by as well. So I think that’s been a big benefit in allowing families to kind of work into that child care process. So yeah. You bring up such a great point on the child
Sarah Roberts
care piece, because that is like a Jenga puzzle, like trying to wait to find a slot, get in a slot, like there’s so many moving pieces. And I feel like infant care is so muddled. Hence the other reason to offer people that hybrid remote transition back because lining up child care, even if you plan a year in advance, like it is so hard. It’s such a puzzle.
Sarah Wilkins
It is I remember, yes, eight years ago, like, second, I found out trying to get on lists and like, I think I heard from one list when my, my child was three. By that time, I was like, I’m good, I’ve got to figure it out now. But, um, yeah, it’s just, it’s just so hard. And so that flexibility is so important, I think, in parenting and allowing, you know, even as they get older, right, there’s still sickness, there’s early school pickups, there’s there’s all of these things. So allowing flexibility with how and when someone gets their work done just makes everyone so much better and life a lot easier. So you kind of hit on some of these things, but for smaller, LinkedIn is obviously a larger organization, more resources. Some of the companies we work with tend to be smaller and they’re wanting to do the best they can, right? but may not have all of the financial resources to provide, you know, a lot of the benefits. If you would summarize, you know, what you’ve said or what may have been the most important or impactful benefits that supported you and your family in the return?
Sarah Roberts
Yeah, that’s a great question. I would say like, even before you go out lining up like what your transition plan is going to be with like a exclamation point on flexibility, like it’s going to change, it’ll evolve. But the more you can line up a transition plan prior to going and then think about your transition plan coming back with a supportive team, with a supportive manager, I’ve seen that be just a game changer in how people feel when they go out in addition to how they feel supported when they come back. The other piece that I think was a really creative way that where I actually leveraged twice when I went out on my first and my third mat leaves is finding a person that wants to do a stretch assignment that can take your role, or cover your role even like a quarter, or part time, or there’s a lot of different moving pieces. But it gives them the opportunity to do something new. It gives you the ability to offload your work to somebody that you know can cover it for that period of time. And that person doesn’t usually have to cut and transition back to their role right when you come back. And so it gives you that ease to transition back, whether it’s part -time the first few weeks, full -time, whatever that might be. But it gives the ability to get your brain space. Because I’d be remiss to say, regardless of how long you’re out, work changes. A lot changes. And so to have somebody that can bring you up to speed, I think, is really helpful. And then you can’t underestimate the importance of having a supportive culture, a culture that really believes in the longevity of employees and their tenor and investing in like a culture that supports moms returning back, dads returning back, families, working families, that supportive culture on, look, we need flexibility and just to get your work done in the hours that work for you, I think is like transformational and retaining your workforce. And then the last I would say is just, like it goes back to that culture, but supportive leaders, supportive teams. And hopefully that’s infused through the culture in which you work, but that’s also makes it less taboo to, you know, talk about your family, like share about your experience, and then for people to feel like they have the confidence to then pave the way for maybe a family if they want one down the road, but to also know that they’ll be supported, and that’s going to trickle down and make it easier for future generations. So hopefully we’re on the curve of making it easier, not harder, but those would be some of the simple things that organizations or companies can think about if they don’t have like a huge benefits package that they can offer. There’s a lot of small things they can do to support their workforce and family planning.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah, absolutely. I love the transition talk. I was actually talking to someone recently about their transition and, you know, just how much they own and do and how to kind of give some people some stretch assignments are starting to delegate now and things like that. So it’s, yeah, and having the support to start that process. So it’s not just like, okay, I’m out. And yeah, the worry and the things around that. So I love, love calling that out. Yeah. What final, you know, thoughts or parting thoughts may you have that you want to share with listeners beyond all the great, you know, advice and ideas you’ve given already?
Sarah Roberts
Oh my gosh I would just to anchor back on the on the coaching piece like if that is something that is in your portfolio of support like it’s so enriching I think not only for parents returning back to work but also just for kind of future career planning life planning thinking and I think it makes um it’s made me a better employee it’s made me more thoughtful in how I approach my work so highly consider that benefit if it’s an option um I can’t speak highly enough of um having that gifted to me as part of my return back.
Sarah Wilkins
Yeah, I love that. Thank you so much. I’m so glad to hear of your great experience and support provided. And it brings me hope for the future, like you said, that we’re making things easier for working parents and families and creating supportive organizations and great leaders. So thank you.
Sarah Roberts
Thank you so much for having me.
Sarah Wilkins
Thank you for listening to this episode of Humans Beyond Resources. Visit ReverbPeople .com to find free resources, subscribe to our newsletter, and connect with our team. If you haven’t already, subscribe to stay up to date on all of our upcoming episodes. We look forward to having you as part of our community. Thank you again to our podcast sponsors.
Parker Smith & Feek is a nationally recognized, privately held brokerage firm. They offer a full range of services, including employee benefits, commercial and personal insurance, and everything in between. The depth and breadth of their staff experience sets them apart as they provide stellar service and imaginative solutions for all clients. Joshua Brittingham of Kearney Bailey Spellman is a seasoned employment lawyer and he works with entrepreneurs and business leaders especially in construction, hospitality, and financial services to help them handle sticky employee situations so they can thrive in a complex world. Joshua is also a professional speaker, panelist, and teacher on the topic of all things employment law. AHT Insurance is an insurance brokerage and consulting firm offering property and casualty, employee benefits, retirement, private client, and international services for clients throughout the United States and 42 other countries. Supporting numerous industries and boasting national recognition in the technology, manufacturing, government contracting, and nonprofit practice areas, AHT offers clients highly customized solutions to identify and help mitigate risks they may face.
